[Newsbot]

Title: U of W student vote on boycotting Israel sparks hate crime
Category: Law & Order
Posted By: commanderkai
Date: 2014-02-28 20:01:58
Canadian

[commanderkai]

Fucking disgraceful. At least it's not being swept under the rug.

[Kazakh]

So much hate everywhere... What a sad world we live in, isn't it...

[Xort]

Not sure it's a hate crime. A boycott of Israel is more or less a denunciation of Zionism for most people. Given that the action was sparked by a reaction to a political exchange it seems most likely to be political opinion.

If the action was to boycott China, and someone painted Mao, would that be a hate crime? How about the USA and Yank? Or Ireland and IRA?

[martin14]

$1:

The issue landed on a referendum ballot at U of W after the student Palestinian Solidarity Group

What a surprise.

[Curtman]

Xort Xort:

Not sure it's a hate crime. A boycott of Israel is more or less a denunciation of Zionism for most people. Given that the action was sparked by a reaction to a political exchange it seems most likely to be political opinion.

If the action was to boycott China, and someone painted Mao, would that be a hate crime? How about the USA and Yank? Or Ireland and IRA?

That's different. Israel is a nation of victims, therefor anyone who criticizes them is an Antisemite.

Or so I've been told.

[N_Fiddledog]

Xort Xort:

Not sure it's a hate crime. A boycott of Israel is more or less a denunciation of Zionism for most people. Given that the action was sparked by a reaction to a political exchange it seems most likely to be political opinion.

If the action was to boycott China, and someone painted Mao, would that be a hate crime? How about the USA and Yank? Or Ireland and IRA?

There's different opinions on that. For example, here's Columnist/Talk Show Host Ben Shapiro talking at a meeting where UCLA was campaigning for a boycott of Israel similar to the one University of Windsor is proposing.

[commanderkai]

Curtman Curtman:

That's different. Israel is a nation of victims, therefor anyone who criticizes them is an Antisemite.

Or so I've been told.

Isn't physically attacking and damaging property of somebody just because they disagree with you politically, or have a different religion than you a hate crime?

Oh, but since they disagree with your political views Curtman, it's alright that they're being harassed and having their property damaged. Right?

[andyt]

commanderkai commanderkai:

Isn't physically attacking and damaging property of somebody just because they disagree with you politically (no), or have a different religion than you (possibly) a hate crime?

Oh, but since they disagree with your political views Curtman, it's alright that they're being harassed and having their property damaged. Right?

The vandalism is certainly not OK. Doing it for political reasons would not fall under hate crime legislation. Calling somebody a zionist, i don't see as a hate crime. Zionists themselves call themselves zionists. In fact many zionists will tell you that being against zionism is anti-semitic.

I hate all this hate crime bullshit. Vandalism and assault are crimes, never crimes of love. Just prosecuted them as such.

[N_Fiddledog]

I agree that "hate crime" legislation is dumb, but I don't agree with people who think these progressives and Islamists pushing for an Israeli boycott in North American universities are not anti-semites. Of course, they are.

[commanderkai]

andyt andyt:

The vandalism is certainly not OK. Doing it for political reasons would not fall under hate crime legislation. Calling somebody a zionist, i don't see as a hate crime. Zionists themselves call themselves zionists. In fact many zionists will tell you that being against zionism is anti-semitic.

I hate all this hate crime bullshit. Vandalism and assault are crimes, never crimes of love. Just prosecuted them as such.

Hmm, I thought it would fall under hate crime legislation. Especially since not only are they specifically choosing to go against individuals with a specific political ideology, but they're using a Star of David and the word "Zionist". Last I checked, encouraging hatred against somebody of specific national and ethic origin also would count.

I agree that hate crime legislation is too broad, but, this was an act of violence to intimidate but those who are against the BDS proposal, and University of Windsor's Jewish student population, as well as any supporter of Israel on campus.

[andyt]

N_Fiddledog N_Fiddledog:

I agree that "hate crime" legislation is dumb, but I don't agree with people who think these progressives and Islamists pushing for an Israeli boycott in North American universities are not anti-semites. Of course, they are.

As usual you want to paint everybody with the same brush. Objecting to Israeli settlements does not make one an anti-semite. Are all pro-settlement people anti-semites (since the other side are semites as well)? I've heard some very racist things said about the Palestinians and Arabs on this site, as well as from settlers and other Israelis. So are all pro-settlement people racist as well?

[andyt]

commanderkai commanderkai:

Hmm, I thought it would fall under hate crime legislation. Especially since not only are they specifically choosing to go against individuals with a specific political ideology, but they're using a Star of David and the word "Zionist". Last I checked, encouraging hatred against somebody of specific national and ethic origin also would count.

I agree that hate crime legislation is too broad, but, this was an act of violence to intimidate but those who are against the BDS proposal, and University of Windsor's Jewish student population, as well as any supporter of Israel on campus.

Politics no, ethnicity and nationality yes, afaIk.

As I say, I don't see how using the word zionist is hatecrime, since they use it themselves, and not the way some blacks use nigger. Zionism is deemed perfectly respectable, so calling somebody what they call themselves, how can that be a hate crime? (IMO, zionism that says Israel has a right to exist is great, not even sure it's zionism. Zionism that calls for a greater Israel, essentially Israel ueber alles, I'm against.)

Star of David - it's on the Israeli flag, so not sure that's always a hate crime.

I do think this vandalism was done in a hateful way, probably motivated by anti-semitism at least in part. I just don't want that law trying to figure all this out. Just charge them with vandalism or such. It's the same with violence. White man beating black - hate crime. Black beating white - ordinary crime. Forget about it.

[commanderkai]

andyt andyt:

Star of David - it's on the Israeli flag, so not sure that's always a hate crime.

I do think this vandalism was done in a hateful way, probably motivated by anti-semitism at least in part. I just don't want that law trying to figure all this out. Just charge them with vandalism or such. It's the same with violence. White man beating black - hate crime. Black beating white - ordinary crime. Forget about it.

True enough. I figured political ideology would be protected, because, well, if I, as a conservative, vandalized your home or attacked your person purely because of your political beliefs, I figured that would be included.

Canada's hate crime statutes do have legislation against targeting an ethnicity and national origin, so it can be argued (and probably will be) that it was an attack against all Israelis as a people.

Either way, it's disgraceful.

[Xort]

N_Fiddledog N_Fiddledog:

I agree that "hate crime" legislation is dumb, but I don't agree with people who think these progressives and Islamists pushing for an Israeli boycott in North American universities are not anti-semites. Of course, they are.

That's a leap of logic.

Do you think that orthodox Jews that are against Zionism are anti-Semitic? Or are they just as they claim anti-Zionists?

You can be against the actions of the nation of Israel, in terms of using military force to secure conquested lands and the oppression of the original inhabitants, while still being pro-Jewish both religious and as a people.

For me it is functionally the same as a group of people from lands that have been captured by the PRC and them asking for a school to break financial relations with the PRC for their ongoing crimes.